Go Back   Pace and Cap - Sartin Methodology & The Match Up > Sartin Methodology Handicapping 101 (102 ...) > Previous 'Handicapping Discussion' Forum > Welcome to the Sartin Methodology
Mark Forums Read
Google Site Search Get RDSS Sartin Library RDSS FAQs Conduct Register Site FAQ Members List Search Today's Posts

Welcome to the Sartin Methodology New members: introduce yourselves! Ask about how to get started, get pointers in the right direction.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-05-2013, 06:11 PM   #1
NeedForSpeed
AlwNW3X
 
NeedForSpeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: St Paul, MN
Posts: 37
Hi from a New Member

Hi everyone. My name is Paul and I am a stone cold new member. I have a decent understanding of racing and the form but its scattered about like my 5 years olds bedroom after a day of destruction. I stumbled onto this site trying to find readings about deceleration and found this fascinating. Then I read this and became hooked.

http://www.sartinmethodology.com/pub...inningPMTR.pdf

I really want to achieve something here. I'm not looking for quick fixes or fancy software. (down the road I see something called RDSS I think I will like) What I want to do is learn and work my butt off so I can become decent at this game and be able to converse with the rest of you on your level. I would like to start at ground zero and learn everything I can so that when I do work with RDSS I can understand all the columns and how to make them work for me. But mostly I want to go forward with Doctor Sartin's ideas. What can I start with to get a base? I read a thread where For The Lead posted example races for people to learn from. In there it was mentioned something about a beginners manual. Is this the right start point? I couldn't find it upon looking but this is my first day here so...

Thank you for your time I appreciate everyone's suggestions.
NeedForSpeed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2013, 07:46 PM   #2
Bill V.
The egg man
 
Bill V.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Carlsbad, California
Posts: 10,005
Start with the proper tools

Hi Paul

My advise to you is start right out with RDSS,
To succeed your going to have to practice. RDSS is a great tool
and there are many free download database files available.
plus FTL's teachings are with RDSS screenshots
and Ted has many videos using RDSS


You can start at the beginning from the early manuals and follow ups
and listen to all the audio files
Eventually you will find that the Sartin Methodology is only as good
as you make it.
You will need to know who the contenders are
You will need to know which is the proper paceline
You will have to make decisions

It will all come together If you take from the teaching area what has been offered to you.
If you give back with questions and progress reports .You will improve and we all can help each other

Is there a beginners manual ?
Not really, But everything you will need is available in the library and in your desire to win
Bill V. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2013, 07:56 PM   #3
Ted Craven
Grade 1
 
Ted Craven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Nanaimo, British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 8,853
Hi Paul,

Welcome! Sounds sort of like Christmas in June for you!

Your query about initial orientation materials sounds similar to a question someone posed earlier this week, about primer materials for a 'rank newcomer'. He was already using RDSS, hence some of the specific points. Here was my response:
1. Use RDSS and download the Example Database which accompanies the RDSS Teaching Forum posts (http://paceandcap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9127). That way, you can follow along with the detailed discussions which include concepts and specific guidelines for paceline selection and contender identification. Plus – you will see fairly quickly how much money you would have made! That will get your (or a brand spanking new person’s) attention and perhaps fortify you/them for the further reading and study.

2. Read Follow Ups 70+ in the Sartin Library for an understanding of the readouts (also see here for some links: www.rdss2.com/help-reference ) and their application, also betting and psychology.

3. Watch existing and newly published RDSS videos (www.rdss2.com/videos-tutorials)

4. If you can purchase the older book ‘Pace Makes the Race’ (preferably 1st Edition, but 2nd Edition is good as well), that will give an overview as well to some of the concepts still important today (http://astore.amazon.com/sartinmetho...ail/096307430X). The 1st Edition is where that excerpt by Doc which you referred to comes from.

5. After doing some amount of homework, make it a regular habit to ask good questions – online – giving as much illustration and specific detail to your question as you can (e.g. using a chosen race to illustrate a question or confusion – and learn how to make and post screen capture illustrations). That will prompt effective replies from smart people who will see your preparedness and seriousness, and who will want to give you some of their valuable time.
I didn't want to overwhelm the gentleman with dozens of references, but to the above I could add:

1. The Paceline Manual (see the Sartin Library)

2. The Las Vegas 1993 Video Seminar

3. This Matchup compilation document, compiled by a few pretty serious Matchup practitioners: www.sartinmethodology.com/pubs/Bradshaw-Matchup-Forum-Compilation.pdf This represents the 'meat' of the contents of the Hat Check Forum.

Don't forget our friend 'Google', which has indexed all the posts on PaceandCap - everything you want to know (more or less): www.rdss2.com/google-sitesearch (or - the link at the left edge of the main site menubar).

Perhaps that's enough for now! Time and initiative should take care of the rest.

Good luck, good skill!

Ted
__________________

R
DSS -
Racing Decision Support System™
Ted Craven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2013, 08:04 PM   #4
JimG
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 992
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedForSpeed View Post
But mostly I want to go forward with Doctor Sartin's ideas.
Paul,

Welcome to Pace and Cap. With respect to what I quoted above, there is no man more qualified that I know of to teach you Doc's way than our own Bill V. Follow his advice to the letter and you will learn how to "go forward with Doctor Sartin's ideas".

Best of luck to you.

Jim
JimG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2013, 12:18 PM   #5
NeedForSpeed
AlwNW3X
 
NeedForSpeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: St Paul, MN
Posts: 37
Thanks to all of your responses. It is like Christmas in that theres a lot to get familiar with. I will take all of your advices and listen to Bill V. closely. Look forward to all of this and when I can get to the point of intelligent poster I will share often.
NeedForSpeed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2013, 01:42 PM   #6
Because I Can Jim
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 203
Hey NeedforSpeed,
Welcome!
I too am new but really not new. At some time in the future, my story will come out. But, for now I had read Pace Makes the Race awhile ago. I am now rereading it and find it full of valuable information.
However, a word of caution, Ted just released RDSS2. What you read in Pace Makes the Race lays a good foundation to start from. However, don't get too bogged down in the "math". It is more important to understand the concepts presented and not to be worrying about calculating variants, adjustments, etc.... That is what RDSS2 is for. With that said, it is well worth the read, but, don't take it as the end all be all to handicapping nirvana.
Best of luck,
Jim
Because I Can Jim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2013, 02:24 PM   #7
Ted Craven
Grade 1
 
Ted Craven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Nanaimo, British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 8,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Because I Can Jim View Post
Hey NeedforSpeed,
Welcome!
I too am new but really not new. At some time in the future, my story will come out. But, for now I had read Pace Makes the Race awhile ago. I am now rereading it and find it full of valuable information.
However, a word of caution, Ted just released RDSS2. What you read in Pace Makes the Race lays a good foundation to start from. However, don't get too bogged down in the "math". It is more important to understand the concepts presented and not to be worrying about calculating variants, adjustments, etc.... That is what RDSS2 is for. With that said, it is well worth the read, but, don't take it as the end all be all to handicapping nirvana.
Best of luck,
Jim
Agree with Jim 100% - RDSS does all the calculations presented in PMTR. What you see there as EPR, FFR, TPR and Early/Late Difference are the same as what you see in RDSS (EPR, LPR, CPR/TPR and Early/Late Diff), same concepts, mostly the same math. RDSS goes beyond PMTR in many ways. But read it for the concept if you want to understand some of the historical underpinnings of RDSS.

Ted
__________________

R
DSS -
Racing Decision Support System™
Ted Craven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2013, 03:13 PM   #8
alydar_ David
Grade 1
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,654
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimG View Post
Paul,

Welcome to Pace and Cap. With respect to what I quoted above, there is no man more qualified that I know of to teach you Doc's way than our own Bill V. Follow his advice to the letter and you will learn how to "go forward with Doctor Sartin's ideas".

Best of luck to you.

Jim
I agree with Jim. You can't do better than reading Bill V.'s posts to get pure Sartin theory.

And always take a good look at Ted's posts. There's a good chance he knows more about RDSS than anyone else. :>)
alydar_ David is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2013, 03:40 PM   #9
glue4659
AlwNW2X
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Delmar, NY
Posts: 28
Welcome David! Don't be afraid to ask ? I am new also, and aside from trying to digest Tom Brohamers book Modern Pace Handicapping back in the 90 s I know a teeny bit about the Methodology and that's probably stretching it a bit! These are a GREAT bunch of folks who really want to teach others......so jump right in!
glue4659 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2013, 12:57 PM   #10
barb craven
Grade 1
 
barb craven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Bobcaygeon,On,Canada
Posts: 1,308
I also add my welcome..Follow all of the above advice and you're well on your way. Good luck.
__________________
Listen...Learn...Stay Safe.
barb craven is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New member introduction dlivery Welcome to the Sartin Methodology 58 11-03-2011 08:57 AM
new member jamesh Welcome to the Sartin Methodology 2 09-16-2011 08:39 AM
I need some help from a advanced member dcn7272 Previous 'Handicapping Discussion' Forum 1 07-11-2011 09:39 AM
New member says hello Socal RDSS 14 03-13-2011 12:26 AM
Healing vibes needed NOW for P&C member RichieP General Discussion 20 02-20-2009 12:15 PM


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:48 AM.