good place to start - Pace and Cap

shoeless · 11-20-2008, 09:08 PM

Im trying to get a better comprehension of the match up not for picking winners but for determing if the race will be run early or late.Im now rereading the match up red manual and find it's a good place to start.

partsnut · 11-21-2008, 09:48 AM

I am not here to criticize any method one might choose to achieve success. What works for some may not work for others. All I can tell you is what worked for me.

In the 121 race cycle that I handicapped in the Meadowlands contest I won 45 races A touch over 37%.(single pick) winners.
Not once during this contest did I look at a split time or first fraction. To me position at the second call and beaten lengths and position at the finish is paramount.
This in accordance with the pace comfort zone, pace velocity and speed points which gives you a fair indication of how the race will run. I am a proponent of PaceAppraiser. I use no software other then the PaceAppraiser Form because I have no need to. However, I made a decision clear to my head and start fresh and dedicate myself to learning a new method that works and has been repeatedly proven.

What ever method works for you - stick with it.
Only you will know what you are comfortable with and what affect it will have on your bankroll.

shoeless · 11-21-2008, 07:17 PM

Parts,Your reply is way off topic.The reason I posted this was that in my opinion the match up is best used to determine if a race will be setup eatly or late,I believe that only Hat was able to pick the winner sucessfully without the aid of a computer.I would like to be more proficent at being able to do this but have nowhere to turn to so I started rereading the manual.The funny thing is before Gary got Jim to post here he had hooked me up with him via e mail but I didnt seize the oppurtunity to learn from him.Rx Lawyer did tell me one time of a gentlemen in Vegas named Jim Mc Elwee who is supposed to be just as good doing the match up as Hat was.I had tried to contact him aways back but never heard from him.Jeff

As a side note and you will think this sounds weird and it's no BS a couple of night ago I had a dream with Hat in it.We were in the desert together chasing someone but I dont know who it was.The funny thing about this was 1)my decision to learn the match up better 2)I have been talking to one of my best friends who moved to Vegas and he is trying to have me do the same.I have enough equity in my house where IF and that's a big one I could sell my place here I could pay cash for something in Vegas and have pocket money left over.Maybe then I can meet up with Mr.Mc Elwee.Jeff

Charlie D · 11-21-2008, 09:08 PM

A good place to start imho is pinned on the wall beside me

Jim Bradshaw's 5 Step Approach to the Match Up

shoeless · 11-21-2008, 09:35 PM

Charlie,That's great but you still might want to take a peek at the red manual since the 5 step approach is an offspring of it.

Charlie D · 11-21-2008, 09:43 PM

Jeff

I've read the Red Manual more than once and i can see why some people had difficulty understanding it

The 5 Step is an easy to understand condensed version of it

The first draft of a document is not always the best

shoeless · 11-22-2008, 08:47 AM

Charlie,Im glad that you found something that works for you that's the main thing.I like the red manual because you also have Doc,Schmidt and Pizzolla chiming in.For me the red manual is not that hard to understand,I know Im in the minority but I thought Hat's 1st book was a easier read then the 2nd.Jeff

Charlie D · 11-22-2008, 09:43 AM

Just my opinion Jeff, but if you want to get better at determining Early or OTE, Start with 5 step and then move onto examples in Hat Check

All the best

tom · 11-22-2008, 10:06 AM

Noting has helped me predict early or OTE like Lil' Cap's recent posts on the subject. Great stuff, really great. I use it regularly now.

shoeless · 11-22-2008, 10:33 AM

Tom,I am unable to post questions there so no sense for me to read the posts but Im glad that it has helped you.

11-20-2008, 09:08 PM	#1
shoeless Grade 1 Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,151	good place to start Im trying to get a better comprehension of the match up not for picking winners but for determing if the race will be run early or late.Im now rereading the match up red manual and find it's a good place to start.

11-21-2008, 09:08 PM	#4
Charlie D Match Up Apprentice Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,105	A good place to start imho is pinned on the wall beside me Jim Bradshaw's 5 Step Approach to the Match Up Attached Images

11-21-2008, 09:43 PM	#6
Charlie D Match Up Apprentice Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,105	Jeff I've read the Red Manual more than once and i can see why some people had difficulty understanding it The 5 Step is an easy to understand condensed version of it The first draft of a document is not always the best Last edited by Charlie D; 11-21-2008 at 09:46 PM.

11-22-2008, 09:43 AM	#8
Charlie D Match Up Apprentice Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,105	Just my opinion Jeff, but if you want to get better at determining Early or OTE, Start with 5 step and then move onto examples in Hat Check All the best Last edited by Charlie D; 11-22-2008 at 09:51 AM.

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11-21-2008, 09:48 AM	#2
partsnut BetMix User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 2,433	I am not here to criticize any method one might choose to achieve success. What works for some may not work for others. All I can tell you is what worked for me. In the 121 race cycle that I handicapped in the Meadowlands contest I won 45 races A touch over 37%.(single pick) winners. Not once during this contest did I look at a split time or first fraction. To me position at the second call and beaten lengths and position at the finish is paramount. This in accordance with the pace comfort zone, pace velocity and speed points which gives you a fair indication of how the race will run. I am a proponent of PaceAppraiser. I use no software other then the PaceAppraiser Form because I have no need to. However, I made a decision clear to my head and start fresh and dedicate myself to learning a new method that works and has been repeatedly proven. What ever method works for you - stick with it. Only you will know what you are comfortable with and what affect it will have on your bankroll.

11-21-2008, 07:17 PM	#3
shoeless Grade 1 Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,151	Parts,Your reply is way off topic.The reason I posted this was that in my opinion the match up is best used to determine if a race will be setup eatly or late,I believe that only Hat was able to pick the winner sucessfully without the aid of a computer.I would like to be more proficent at being able to do this but have nowhere to turn to so I started rereading the manual.The funny thing is before Gary got Jim to post here he had hooked me up with him via e mail but I didnt seize the oppurtunity to learn from him.Rx Lawyer did tell me one time of a gentlemen in Vegas named Jim Mc Elwee who is supposed to be just as good doing the match up as Hat was.I had tried to contact him aways back but never heard from him.Jeff As a side note and you will think this sounds weird and it's no BS a couple of night ago I had a dream with Hat in it.We were in the desert together chasing someone but I dont know who it was.The funny thing about this was 1)my decision to learn the match up better 2)I have been talking to one of my best friends who moved to Vegas and he is trying to have me do the same.I have enough equity in my house where IF and that's a big one I could sell my place here I could pay cash for something in Vegas and have pocket money left over.Maybe then I can meet up with Mr.Mc Elwee.Jeff

11-21-2008, 09:35 PM	#5
shoeless Grade 1 Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,151	Charlie,That's great but you still might want to take a peek at the red manual since the 5 step approach is an offspring of it.

11-22-2008, 08:47 AM	#7
shoeless Grade 1 Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,151	Charlie,Im glad that you found something that works for you that's the main thing.I like the red manual because you also have Doc,Schmidt and Pizzolla chiming in.For me the red manual is not that hard to understand,I know Im in the minority but I thought Hat's 1st book was a easier read then the 2nd.Jeff

11-22-2008, 10:06 AM	#9
tom Grade 1 Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 644	Noting has helped me predict early or OTE like Lil' Cap's recent posts on the subject. Great stuff, really great. I use it regularly now.

11-22-2008, 10:33 AM	#10
shoeless Grade 1 Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,151	Tom,I am unable to post questions there so no sense for me to read the posts but Im glad that it has helped you.