Go Back   Pace and Cap - Sartin Methodology & The Match Up > Sartin Methodology Handicapping 101 (102 ...) > Previous 'Handicapping Discussion' Forum
Get RDSSMark Forums Read
Google Site Search Get RDSS Sartin Library RDSS FAQs Conduct Register Site FAQ Members List Search Today's Posts

Previous 'Handicapping Discussion' Forum General Handicapping Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-01-2006, 01:53 AM   #1
tompkins
Grade 1
 
tompkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 708
Derby seasoning

First, thanks Ted for the cards to analyze. I am going to put up screen shots of "theoretical" contenders in the Derby who were good, but just not on the first Saturday in May and one of the many liknesses of this group is 6 lifetime starts of less. If you don't come into this race with a decided total energy near the top (>161), style (median in the range of 67.4 to 68 TOPS) and have an edge in all of these categories, it is not going to happen as many will show like Medalia D'Oro for one. Others Scrimshaw, Ten Most Wanted, Congaree, Millenium Wind, Express Tour, .......more to follow as I think Tapit was already exposed this way. Even Empire Maker had 5 lifetime starts but had a big edge in the other categories. Still a strike against that one which the colt almost overcame.
__________________
velocititian
tompkins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006, 09:57 AM   #2
tompkins
Grade 1
 
tompkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 708
first some of the exceptions

improvement improvement over inexperience.
Attached Images
 
__________________
velocititian
tompkins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006, 11:25 AM   #3
tompkins
Grade 1
 
tompkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 708
couldn't overcome it

lack of experience cost this one. We know what happened later on.
Attached Images
 
__________________
velocititian
tompkins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006, 11:32 AM   #4
tompkins
Grade 1
 
tompkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 708
some of the others and total dirt starts

not an exhaustive list, but something to consider.
St Averil 5, Freinds Lake 5, Bellamy Road 5, High Fly 6, Greely's Galaxy 4, Lion Heart 5, Flower Alley 4, Bandini 5, Tapit 4, Wild Horses 5, Johannesburg 1 dirt start, Congaree 4, Express Tour 5, Millenium WInd 5, Scrimshaw 5, Birdstone 5, Smarty 6, Quinton's Gold Rush 5, Atswhatimtalkinabout 5, Funny 6, Empire Maker 5, Eye of the Tiger 5, Ten Most Wanted 5.

At 5 lifetime starts, unless there is a big advantage (Monarchos), one might take pause to dowgrade it's chances. Highlighted are those that had OTHER things going for them.
__________________
velocititian
tompkins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006, 12:12 PM   #5
tompkins
Grade 1
 
tompkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 708
big favorite, short on experience

fell a bit short in the seasoning department
Attached Images
 
__________________
velocititian
tompkins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006, 12:14 PM   #6
tompkins
Grade 1
 
tompkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 708
short experience

going the wrong way towards the big race
Attached Images
 
__________________
velocititian
tompkins is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-01-2006, 06:23 PM   #7
Dap Daddi
Dap Daddi
 
Dap Daddi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 138
Dr. Tompkins:
I keep re-interating that a majority oof the 20 Derby Entrants are missing racing seasoning. Even when one takes a look at Fusaji Pegasis and Sunny's Halo, they did in fact win the Kentucky Derby buts that is all they won. Neither went on to win the Preakness or Belmont.

My point is that if one of the Derby Entrants should win the Big Dance with 6 or lss total lifetime starts, they did bucking the system! Ten of the 20 entrants have eight starts or more. To me I beleive this is where the true winner is gong to come from.

Barbaro: 5 Starts
Sinister Minister: 5 Starts
Sunriver: 6 Starts
Sacred Light: 6 Starts (Only a maiden win of the 6 starts)
Flashy Bull: 9 Starts with just a maiden win.
Storm Treasure: 6 Starts
Jazil: 6 Starts (to add insult to injury only a maiden win!)
Keyed Entry: 5 starts
Showing Up: 3 Starts
Point Determined: 6 starts
Hemingways Key: 6 Starts( One a Maiden and the other a N1X What a joke)
Mister Triester: 8 Starts (Only a Maden win another joke!)
Malameeze: 10 starts with just a maiden win to his credit
Greeley's Galaxy: 10 Starts with a lucky third on a sloppy track in a Gr. 2
Red Raymond: 9 Starts with 2 wins coming in sprint races.

I make this point so that when a true Derby contder is discussed, the pretenders are not brought up in the conversation. In my opinion the above horses are pretenders and should labeled as such.

I am ready to handicap the Derby!

Dap!
Dap Daddi is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Kentucky Derby 2006 - Open Forum RichieP Previous 'Handicapping Discussion' Forum 56 04-29-2006 04:08 PM
Penn Derby winner admin General Discussion 0 04-16-2006 07:23 AM
Derby Preps jms62 Selections 49 03-26-2006 07:30 AM
The PA Derby Binder General Discussion 3 09-08-2005 09:09 PM
The PA derby Binder Selections 0 09-05-2005 03:37 PM


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions Inc.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:34 PM.