Pace and Cap  - Sartin Methodology & The Match Up

Pace and Cap - Sartin Methodology & The Match Up (http://paceandcap.com/forums/index.php)
-   Hat Check - How Can We Help You? (http://paceandcap.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=35)
-   -   "Hat" tip on Fathers Day (http://paceandcap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2489)

RichieP 08-02-2007 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbulator (Post 22250)
So I take it you just ignored the fact that the 4 had never run on the turf.

YES. It wasn't his fault.

:)

RichieP 08-02-2007 08:30 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbulator (Post 22250)
So I take it you just ignored the fact that the 4 had never run on the turf.

If I may show you something. The 4 has no "common ground" on the grass with any horse as he has never been on it.

He DOES have "common ground" on the dirt having raced at same track(Keeneland) and distance structure(sprint) with the 3 horse(who placed).

Here are the 2 lines shown together to match. WHO is the bet if the race is down to these 2 horses?

This is why we use the ENTIRE past performances for the horses. We use them to HELP us match horses WITHOUT using variants/adjustments.

This is how I was taught by The Hat and I am passing it along.

We NEED an open and relaxed mind to do this.

Turbulator 08-02-2007 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richie
If I may show you something. The 4 has no "common ground" on the grass with any horse as he has never been on it.

He DOES have "common ground" on the dirt having raced at same track(Keeneland) and distance structure(sprint) with the 3 horse(who placed).

Hmmm. You've mentioned the phrase "common ground" several times now. I've attached a screen shot of both the 3 and 4 horse.

The 3 has raced on the turf. The 4 hasn't. They have both raced at Keenland, but not against each other.

So are you saying that because the 3 has raced on the turf successfully, and that because the 4 matches up well with the 3 even though the 4 has never raced on the turf, that he will do well on the turf because they have both raced at keenland?

RichieP 08-02-2007 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbulator (Post 22255)
Hmmm. You've mentioned the phrase "common ground" several times now.

YES I have Steve.

It is something that is VERY important to matching horses
"Hat Style".

There are very few people who will do this. It is easier to know about "common ground" than to have to worry bout track-track adjustments.

THIS is Jim Bradshaw's Matchup way to making adjustments.

Richie

RichieP 08-02-2007 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbulator (Post 22255)
The 3 has raced on the turf. The 4 hasn't. They have both raced at Keenland, but not against each other.

So are you saying that because the 3 has raced on the turf successfully, and that because the 4 matches up well with the 3 even though the 4 has never raced on the turf, that he will do well on the turf because they have both raced at keenland?


I am saying the 4 will beat the 3 on ANY surface/ Any distance UNTIL he proves he can NOT.

This is Jim Bradshaw's Matchup.
Richie

mufasa 08-02-2007 11:29 AM

Great stuff: “I am saying the 4 will beat the 3 on ANY surface/ Any distance UNTIL he proves he can NOT.

This is Jim Bradshaw's Matchup.
Richie”


It is not about who has raced on the dirt or not or turf or not or even route vs. sprint. It is all about who is the faster horse today and the Match Up Methodology gives you the tools to figure that out. You can use Tandem and Common Ground and Power Lines and Power Moves and while doing that use all of the pp’s available which is in most cases 10. The DRF has 12 or more so I wonder would that be better.

It would seem to me that in the end if you can not get past the differences in distances or surfaces then insist on high odds. You may miss a few but at least you would not be going against your long held feelings on the subject.

The part that makes me happiest is that once you do have a race with contenders that are perfectly matched as to distance and surface how powerful must the Match Up Methodology be then.

I am sold hook, line, and sinker,

Robert

emilio840 08-02-2007 02:12 PM

Richie, I usually like to bet fast sprinters in routes where I see that the Sprinter is faster.

My question is You can use two lines to pick your horse. (power line which is the fast times and power moves which shows his fast positional moves in a race.

Is this what Jim means when he tells me that he always uses more than one line to pick his winner.

emilio

RichieP 08-02-2007 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emilio840 (Post 22262)
My question is You can use two lines to pick your horse. (power line which is the fast times and power moves which shows his fast positional moves in a race.

Is this what Jim means when he tells me that he always uses more than one line to pick his winner.
emilio

YES YES YES amigo.

Now watch this.

WHEN it helps you take the Power Move from one line and use THAT for your POSITIONS with the Power Line.

so in the above case use line 2 as the pace of race Power Line. Use the Power Move from line 3 and COMBINE them into ONE line in your head.

21.2 - 44.2 - 108.1
Positions 9-8-3-1

btw the winning POSITIONAL move by the 4 from the result chart?
10-8-5-1
9-8-3-1

Amazing ha?

This is Jim Bradshaw's Matchup guys.

THIS is what the Hat does ALL THE TIME.

Turbulator 08-02-2007 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichieP (Post 22257)
I am saying the 4 will beat the 3 on ANY surface/ Any distance UNTIL he proves he can NOT.

This is Jim Bradshaw's Matchup.
Richie

OK, fair enough. One last question on this subject. Polytrack. Do you just treat it like any other surface? Do horses on Polytrack matchup just like horses on dirt or turf?

VoodooFan 08-02-2007 05:40 PM

Question
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RichieP (Post 22242)
Here is the EARLY SPRINTER Jim talks about in the opening post here man.

  • Are you specific about this: FAST Early sprinters and/or FAST Early Pressers?
  • Lines 3,4, and 5 the winner's past performance shows he like's 46's.
  • Line 2, he did good against a 44's.
  • Last line, he tanked against 45's.
  • So did you DISREGARD that last line because his NORMAL is 46's?
  • Did you also DISREGARD Line 2 because he simply OVERACHIEVED in that race and that is not his normal fractions? I probably would have MIS- applied the "Hat Helper" because of that last line BASED on Line 2. Thanks Richie.
VoodooFan


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:27 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions Inc.